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Sourcing a medieval COA

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Sourcing a medieval COA

Posted: 1360340738000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1360341009000
Does anyone know an armorial or source that would document the coat of arms of a minor noble in the Luxembourg area between about 1100-1350 AD?

A knight (title of "Seigneur" in French so basically "Lord of the Manor") took the name "de Vance" around 1100 and was a vassal of the Count of Chiny in Lotharingia in what is now the south-eastern tip of Belgium. At times over the next few centuries the family owed fealty to Chiny, Loos, Bar, and Luxembourg. A Belgian historian published extensive research on the family about 50 years ago which is generally well-sourced but he quotes only "old records" for the coat of arms carried by the early de Vances which he says was "Or, four pales gules in chief."

I know what that looks like (attached) but am wondering if there are any known available records to confirm it. Rietstap at least doesn't have it listed.

Loutsch's armorial does give a completely different shield for "de Vance" - "seven fleurs de lys posed 2-3-2" (doesn't mention tinctures). However, the title of "de Vance" passed to families of other surnames by about 1350; it's entirely possible either someone in the de Vance family registered a new COA, or that it's one for a later family with the title but a different surname. "de Vance" as a family surname (without the title) died out in the region in the mid 1600s; the title continued until local titles were abolished after the French Revolution.

I realize this is a long shot but was wondering if any of the experts knew of a source that might have documented those first arms.

(and yes, by the way, I'm aware that there are other arms registered for "Vance", in particular an Irish one and an English one both from the 1800s. And no, I'm not claiming any of these, just interested in the history!).

Dave Vance


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