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1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

Posted: 1054240007000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Surnames: Lietz/Leitz
Could some generous soul look for John Lietz or John Leitz in the 1860 and 1870 Census? They would be in or around the Rosendale area at the time. I do have their information from the 1880 Census.

Many thanks in advance.

Re: 1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

Posted: 1054526470000
Classification: Query
Nicole ~

I took a look at the 1860 U.S. census for you, for Fond du Lac county. There was no John Lietz or Leitz or Leets there at that time. There was only an Adam Leets, living with his wife and no children in Rosendale. I'm not sure whether the John Lietz/Leitz you're referring to in the later 1880 census was the one married to Henrietta (both born Prussia) with 8 kids (Emma and August, the oldest). Or the other 1880 Rosendale John Lietz/Leitz, 24-year-old son of Jacob. Either way, the birthplaces and ages of those two Lietz families would indicate that those families were still in Prussia in 1860.

Hope that helps.

Best,
Kathe C.

Re: 1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

Posted: 1054562354000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Surnames: Lietz/Leitz
Thanks for replying Ms. Cunningham. You had helped me out before, and I was hoping you would check this section again.

Wow, I'm impressed you had the time to do such a thorough job and check the entire Fond du Lac county from 1860. Thank you! Interestingly enough, I have a copy of an 1864 Deed from Adam and Amelia Lietz to John Lietz. I'm not 100% positive that this is my John Lietz -- I have copies of his Deed to his 60 acre farm that I was able to confirm as the correct John Lietzs property through probate records, and this property has a different legal description. And I have no idea if he was related to Adam Lietz. Quite a coincidence, is it not?

Regardless, the John Lietz I was referring to is in fact the one you found, married to Henrietta Lietz with 8 kids (at the time -- they ended up having 11 total). Again, quite a coincidence that there was another John Lietz/Leitz living in the same county at the same time!

Were you able to check the 1870 census? My records show that my John Lietz purchased his property in 1866 in Rosendale (based on a copy of his deed). I would think he would have to be in there somewhere! If you have an opportunity, could you take a look?

Many thanks (once again, and as always!).

Nicole Lietz

Re: 1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

Posted: 1054590695000
Classification: Query
Hi Nicole ~

I thought that was you!! Happy to help anytime (always feel free, too, to use my "home" email address if you ever want to be sure I a question that you have). It's kbcunning@aol.com

You right, very intriguing about the Adam Lietz to John Lietz connection. Most often when people immigrated to the U.S. during the mid 19th century, they headed right for a town where they already had a relative or family friends living. That could explain why John Lietz and his family landed where Adam Lietz was already living -- some relationship there, I'm sure.

Nicole, the one U.S. census that I don't have is the 1870, darn it. Sure wish I did. You might want to try using the www.google.com search engine, and typing 1870 CENSUS WISCONSIN in the search blank. It may well pull up a couple of sites that provide you with an email address (or some message board contact) for someone that has that census and is helping people find things in it.

Best!
Kathe

Re: 1860 and 1870 Census Look Up Request

Posted: 1054600876000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Surnames: Lietz, Leitz
Hi Kathe,

Thanks again for your prompt response and insight. It's interesting to hear other's views about genealogy and how things tended to occur.

Too bad about the 1870 census. I will take your advice and see if I can't find something out on the web. Worse come to worse, I will see if I can't get the microfilm through the Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints location (albeit time consuming).

Take care! Let me know if you need anything regarding the Chicago area.

Nicole

1870 John F. Lietz Family - Rosendale, Wisconsin

Posted: 1059198181000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1076122865000
I am fairly certain the 1870 census in Rosendale showing Frederick Lutze (probably really screwed up by the census taker) is the right guy with family. Plus this fits with other info and helps to answer lots of your questions. Another reason I think this Frederick in 1870 is your John Lietz is because in the 1910 census, John is listed as John F. Lietz.

Frederick Lutze (John F. Lietz), age 31, Prussia
Henrietta, age 29, Prussia
Bertha, age 3, born Wisconsin
Emma, age 6/12, born Wisconsin, probably Rosendale.

In my experience in German records, normally they have 2 or 3 first names, and the GTA listing shows Joh. which normally is short for Johann. So I think his full German name would be Johann Friedrich Leitz, or Americanized to John Frederick Lietz.

This 1870 census also shows 2 kids, Bertha and Emma, and both born in Wisconsin, probably Rosendale. The 1880 census is most likely in error, showing the first 5 kids born in Prussia, and they should all be born in Rosendale, Wisconsin or nearby.

This makes sense when you look at the other info in the other census showing marriage in 1865 and the first born Emma or Bertha born in 1866 in Wisconsin. Also John Lietz, b. Oct 1869 shows born in Wisconsin in the 1900, 1910, and 1920 censuses, which proves more of the error of the 1880 census showing John born in Prussia.

So my best guess is John Leitz met and married his wife, Henrietta in 1865, or shortly after John arrived in 1865 in Rosendale. John then purchased land in 1866 according to your records.

The 1900 census shows immigration in 1865, the 1910 census shows imm. in 1864 (hard to read) and Hattie in 1859, and the 1920 shows imm in 1870. The census is usually in error with these immigration dates, but the 1865 matches with the one Joh. Leitz I have in the GTA, arriving in 10 July 1865 on the ship Saxonia. The 1920 census shows naturalized in 1875 so this looks appropriate because it takes about 10 years.

On the microfilm, which one did you order?

The one I would order is the Hamburg Passenger Arrival, direct list, film number 0472896, Bd. 19 for 1865; or the name index, film 0884672 for names KATZ, Samuel to LEWIN, And.

Usually they are on the direct listing, however if he is not on the direct listings then try the indirect list.

These films numbers are from:
http://www.genealogienetz.de/misc/emig/ham_pass.html#dirlist

The Arrival Passenger list at NY usually does not have any info on the town in Germany, and this is where the Germans To America series gets its info. However the Hamburg Passenger Departure Listings normally show the town in Germany. From this you can order the parish that serves the town. The parish can normally be found fairly easily through the online info at the Morman site in the Family History Catalog, or at this German site under Locations:

http://www.mfpev.de/

Looks like your in for some fun and excitting research!

Hamburg Passenger Listing - Correction

Posted: 1059224870000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1076122865000
I said in my previous message "The one I would order is the Hamburg Passenger Arrival, direct list, film number 0472896, Bd. 19 for 1865; or the name index, film 0884672 for names KATZ, Samuel to LEWIN, And."

I meant the Hamburg Passenger "Departure" Listing (Manifest) at Hamburg, not the "Arrival List", but same FHC numbers.

Here is what they look like, this one is my KRUSEs in 1869.

Hamburg Passenger "Departure" List
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fkruse/shiprec.htm

New York Passenger "Arrival" List
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fkruse/newyork.htm

So in summary there are 2 lists. One is the "Arrivals" which the Germans To America are made from, and usually don't show the town, only the country, and the "Departure" list which normally shows the town.

Re: Hamburg Passenger Listing - Correction

Posted: 1059316397000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Thanks for the clarification.

Re: Hamburg Passenger Listing - Correction

Posted: 1059316448000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Thanks for the clarification.

Re: Hamburg Passenger Listing - Correction

Posted: 1059316474000
Classification: Query
Edited: 1062946553000
Thanks for the clarification.
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